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Judges Corner   April – May 2005   -  from Hunting Retriever magazine

by Tim Gibson

I promised in the February – March issue that in this one; we’d get back to the familiar scenario format.  We’ll do that with a couple of interesting Started situations and some discussions about the Upland Hunt test.  Before we get started, no pun intended, I’ve got what you might classify as a housekeeping announcement.  Lately, I’ve had an inordinate amount of Spam hitting my e-mail’s Inbox.  Who hasn’t?  It takes a bunch of my time to deal with it and it can be dangerous to one’s computer.  I’ve been forced to set my e-mail filter to HIGH security, which means that anybody sending me mail that is not already in my address book must click on a “request to be unblocked” form.  It’s not difficult but it requires an extra manual step to get mail to me that an automated Spam program can’t perform. To let HRC members avoid this hassle I’ve acquired an additional e-mail address, which the spammers don’t have.  It requires no unblocking maneuvers: judgescorner@huntingretrieverclub.org.  I enjoy hearing from all of you so don’t hesitate to contact me if you have a question or comment on anything I’ve written about in this column.

 

Speaking of that, I received a few pithy comments, as I knew I would about some of the field rep conference call agenda items I discussed in the last issue.  I thought you might find a couple interesting.  


 

From the Judges Corner Email bag:

 

Regarding my comments on appropriate clothing and what our rulebook says about this subject.  One reader said:

 

            Personally I do not have a problem with having to dress in camo head to toe, but I do feel that the wording used to describe the requirement does need work. It should read exactly what is expected. This rule has essentially been unchanged for some time and it seems that HRC has a variation in interpretation. Thus it became necessary for you to write about this.  Your clarification was only good for this month’s issue of the magazine. What about 3 years from now with new people moving in HRC”?   

 

 

Regarding callbacks, a reader responded:

 

            I am so proud of your article regarding “callbacks”.  I almost thought for a while there that my husband and I were the only ones angry about the callback situations we faced last year.  You’re right, if it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, looks like a duck, then it must be a duck!  

 

I’ll share more reader feedback in future columns.  For now, let’s get right to our first scenario, which involves a simple marking test at Started.   


Scenario: 

The judges at the Started land series had set up a very good marking test with highly visible birds and good separation between the falls.  The dog in question was handled to the area of the fall on each bird.  Remarkably, the dog handled well.  The regional field representative happened to witness the dog’s run and out of curiosity asked the judges how they graded the dog.  Both said “okay”. 

Question: 

Do you agree that the dog’s performance was acceptable?   

Answer: 

The field rep involved wrote to me and stated, “We’ve got to get our Started judges (mostly the new ones…I could even say this would apply to all judges) to understand what standard of performance for marking (and memory in other series) is expected of the dogs they are judging. I think this is an area we really need to stress in our seminars because it is the very foundation for how we judge our dogs.”   

To the casual observer who might not understand what is required of a Started dog at our hunts, it would appear this dog did a fine job retrieving the birds that were thrown for it.  The dog picked up each bird quickly and efficiently and showed good control while taking direction from the handler.  However, being more than just casual observers, the judges should have known better.  In fairness, and because I’m always ready to give judges the benefit of the doubt, I should say this; I suppose it’s possible the judges did not hear the field rep correctly, and thought he said, “How are you guys doing today?” If that’s not the case, then they either; a) did not know the dog didn’t mark either bird, or b) did not know marking is what we are testing when we throw birds for dogs. What I do know for sure is we can’t claim by any stretch of the imagination that this dog “marked” either bird, which would be the reason this would not be a passing performance at Started, nor any level of testing for that matter.   

With the tact and graciousness your dedicated corps of field representatives are renown for, the judges were given a quick field lesson in what was required of a Started dog.  The first paragraph of the Guidelines – Judging Started Hunt Tests on page 31 of our rulebook states, “This is a test designed to assess the ability of the dog to follow the flight of the shot bird to the area of the fall, and its ability to go directly to the area of the fall, retrieve the bird and return it to the Handler.” The rep went on to tell the judges that a Started dog should execute its marks with the same precision as a Grand dog. He said,  “They really blinked at that one!”  It’s true.  When a mark is thrown at any testing level, a dog must sight the bird, proceed directly to the area of the fall, and initiate a hunt for the bird in the area of the fall.  The rep explained that the difference between Started marks and Grand marks were the conditions under which the marks were thrown such as terrain, cover, distance, number of marks, etc.  

Not only must our judges have a good grasp of evaluating marking and memory, it’s important that handlers understand what is expected of them and their dog.  In addition to their first obligation of throwing birds that the dogs can see clearly, judges must at every testing level, especially at Started, carefully explain the objective of the marking test. In fact, our rulebook requires it.  Handlers need to understand what the dog must do on its own to show it has properly marked a bird.  When going for a marked retrieve, the dog must go directly to the Area of the Fall (AOF) of the thrown bird, and establish a hunt in the AOF.  When I use the term “on its own”, I mean without any aid from the handler.  Given our scenario, for arguments sake let’s say the judges understood this yet did not explain it, but the handler did not.  Now the dog does fine on the water test that followed.  Expecting their first ribbon, and already receiving congratulations from his friends who came to watch the dog run, you can imagine how devastating it would be for this handler to be told at the conclusion of the hunt that the dog failed.   

We spend a good portion of the Judges/Handlers Seminar discussing judging marking and memory and I’ve written exhaustively about it in this column.  Without question, it’s one of the most difficult aspects of testing to fully comprehend and evaluate properly, even for judges at the Grand hunt level.  For handlers, it can be as equally perplexing to try to figure out what to do in the test and what the judges expect. We’ll spend some time discussing this in a future article. Our next scenario takes place at another Started test.  We teach judges that marking tests at both the Started and Seasoned levels should be conducted in the absence of distractions. As this Started scenario unfolded an unnatural distraction disrupted the test at a most inopportune time and the judges had to make some quick decisions.   


Scenario: 

The handler brought his retriever to the line at the Started water test and signaled ready.  The first duck was thrown and the dog was sent.  About 15 ft. out in route to the bird, a car alarm went off in the parking area behind the retrieving line.  Confused and clearly distracted, the dog turned in the water to look back at the handler.  The handler looked to the judges for direction, assuming they’d call a no bird.  Although it was apparent they knew what distracted the dog, the judges remained silent. The handler re-heeled the dog and recast it and it had no difficulty completing the retrieve this time.  

Question: 

Does this story simply prove the old adage, “All’s well that ends well”, or is there more of a lesson to be learned here?  Of course there is and some of that lesson involves discussing the following: 1) should the judges have said anything to the handler? 2) should the judges have declared a no bird? And 3) what would have happened had the dog not been successful on the subsequent attempt to pick up the bird… could or should the judges at that point offer the dog a re-run? 

Answer: 

Some of you will recognize this scenario from a recent post on the HRC message board.  In the interest of space and with my license to edit, I’ve not re-written it word for word, but I believe I’ve given you the gist of the post.  After several members responded on the board and offered their opinions and thoughts on the scenario, the author e-mailed me and asked for mine.  I will admit that on rare occasions the message board has served as a well I’ve drawn from when I’ve needed a scenario for this column.  Usually when I’m looking for material, all I have to do is attend a couple of hunt tests, or to be more specific, follow a certain handful of judges around (you know who you are) and I can get all the scenarios I need!  I’m just kidding of course, but I did hear that a certain young and upcoming judge was having difficulty gaining his club’s endorsement to move to the next judging level for the oddest reason.  The club asked him to explain why Tim Gibson happened to show up at every test he’d judged and asked him if they were expected to believe this was just by coincidence!”   

After reading the threads associated with the post, I found myself agreeing with what appeared to be the majority of opinions of those folks on the board who responded to it.  I did e-mail the author my thoughts, which I’ll share with you, and which I hope will help answer the questions posed above.  I responded with the following: 

“I think I understand why the judges handled it like they did.  They probably noted that you had an attentive dog that got a good look at the mark (and the splash) and was going with enthusiasm when sent.  They obviously felt it was better to simply let you re-send than declare a no-bird and make you come back to re-run.  As a judge, I've often put my faith in a dog in circumstances where I know the handler was thinking we would or could or perhaps should be calling a no bird.  Where I see signs that a dog is not going to handle a situation well - for example a Started dog that is exhibiting poor control at the line and swinging it's head off the mark, etc., I'm more likely to make the no-bird call quicker when something happens that might disrupt the retrieve.  Experienced judges that have learned to make these calls are right far more than they are wrong.   

The underlying question you are probably thinking about is what would have happened had the dog not handled the re-cast?  Could the judges have backed up and offered a re-run to the dog.  Yes, it’s my opinion they could.  I believe you said the dog stopped on it's own when the car alarm sounded.  Usually when I think of a re-cast it's because the handler didn't like what the dog was doing or where it was going and decided to try the retrieve again.  In your case, you recalled the dog after it stopped because of the alarm. I could not in good conscious count that as a legitimate attempt to make the retrieve.  If the dog had problems on the subsequent attempt, I believe good judges would have said this is not working because of the unnatural distraction and interference, and invited you back in three dogs.  I think your judges would likely have done this.”  

Regular readers know I’ll usually quote some part of our rulebook when covering a scenario.  I didn’t do that in my response above because quite frankly there is not much in it that we can specifically point to that covers this scenario and the questions around it.  When that happens, we’ve got to drop back and rely on common sense and fairness to the dog and handler, and look at the intent behind our rules and what we’re trying to accomplish with our testing.  This is not the same think as making up rules because something is not covered in our rulebook or because the rulebook does not say we can’t do it.  I was pleased and proud that most of the messages on the thread regarding this scenario did just that.  Let’s change gears now and take a look at a question that came up at a recent Upland Hunt test. 


Scenario: 

At the Upland Hunt test, the judges inserted a land blind retrieve into their test.  Their rationale was that since the Upland was run "under Finished rules” anything allowed in a Finished test was fair game in an Upland test - that the rules allowed multiple marks and blinds as part of the Upland test.   

Question: 

Were the judges correct and can they do this? 

Answer: 

This happened at a recent Upland Hunt test, and almost occurred at a couple of others that I’m aware of.  One field rep had to explain to some judges that,  “Yes, in real Upland hunting somebody might shoot a bird the dog does not flush nor see shot and fall, but blind retrieves are not what we’re here to test today”.  The judges were correct on one point… The first sentence of the first paragraph under Test Rules in the Upland Hunt portion of our rulebook says, “The Upland Hunt Test will be conducted according to the rules already established in this rulebook for the Finished Hunting Retriever.” They were wrong that this wording allowed them to put any element of a Finished test into their Upland series.   

The Upland rules sentence referenced above is there for basically two reasons.  The first is it tells us that the Upland dog should perform, and will be evaluated to, the same standards as a Finished dog in some areas of testing.  An “AA” Finished, licensed Upland Hunt Test judge who I recently discussed this with nailed it when he said the sentence refers to standards of performance expected in a Finished dog, i.e. controlled breaks, creeping, response, delivery, hunt desire, perseverance, etc.  Secondly, this sentence is a way to avoid duplication of portions of the rulebook.  A couple of examples of the above come to mind:   

1) Under "Handlers", page 47, we see that "voice or whistle commands may be used to encourage the hunting retriever".  This reads the same as in Finished.  But the Finished rules and guidelines expand on this by saying on page 40, "... however, should excessive handling or noise occur, which in the opinion of the Judges would disturb the hunt, the Judges may declare failure of the test".  The Upland is not that specific, but we can also conclude that the Upland dog should demonstrate a prompt and precise response to all voice, whistle, and directional commands because the Finished dog must do so (page 39, item II). 

2) Page 49 of the Upland rules, Quartering, does a nice job of explaining what to look for when the flush occurs and what the dog is supposed to do.  It indicates the dog should stop within a reasonable distance after a flush and should be accessed a refusal if it does not.  It also explains what a controlled break is, i.e., a dog that stops, then leaves before being sent.  What it does not do is set a standard for how to judge controlled breaks.  For that, we can look at Finished that says a controlled break may result in failure.  While we’re discussing the Upland, let’s take a quick look at one more Upland scenario. 


Scenario: 

The club was discussing their upcoming Upland Hunt test.  Some folks had contacted the club about entering the hunt with pointing dogs.  The discussion turned to whether it was acceptable in the Upland for a pointer (or pointing lab for that matter) to hold point while its handler flushed the bird.  A portion of the club members felt this might be okay as long as the dog remained steady to the flush and shot. 

Question: 

Can the handler flush the bird in our Upland tests while the dog is on “point”? 

Answer: 

I’ll make this short and sweet.  NO.  The HRC Upland Hunt test program was designed for flushing breeds of dogs.  Our rulebook is clear.  The Upland Test Rules, page 49, item II, Quartering – says, “The Upland Hunting dog is expected to flush the bird”.  The sentence that immediately follows this states, “After the flush is made the dog should come to a stop on its own or on the command of the Handler”.  It’s pretty clear to me that the intent is for a dog to be moving toward the bird, or in the event a trap or release is used because conditions prohibit the use of natural flushes, toward said devices.  I would submit to you that it’s much more difficult for a dog to be steady to flush while moving into the scent of a planted bird or one in a launching device than for a dog to show steady that is already stopped.  A handler whose dog stops, or points the bird in our Upland test would need to find a way to get the dog to release point on command and attempt to flush the bird.   

We hope the “Judge’s Corner” will both entertain and inform you.  

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